Talk:Zoroastrianism in Armenia

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Zoroastrianism in Armenia[edit]

In response to the personal attacks leveled against other editors, and a certain editor's refusal to use the talk page:

Nationalism and Religion in Contemporary Iran, Eliz Sanasarian, "Religious Minorities in the Middle East: Domination, Self-Empowerment, Accommodation", ed. Anh Nga Longva, Anne Sofie Roald, page 313;"Later, Armenian Christianity retained some Zoroastrian vocabulary and ritual. Reports indicate that there were Zoroastrian Armenians in Armenia until the 1920s."
"Zoroastrians: Their Religious Beliefs and Practices", Mary Boyce, page 84;"In 62 A.C. the Parthian King Vologeses put his younger brother Tiridates on the Armenian throne, and this cadet branch of the Arsacids ruled there into the Sasanian period. Tiridates was himself a strictly observant Zoroastrian - Roman sources even call him a magus - and there is no doubt that during the latter part of the Parthian period Armenia was a predominantly Zoroastrian land."

Looks like Armenia was predominantly Zoroastrian before their conversion to Christianity. --Kansas Bear (talk) 19:45, 19 April 2020 (UTC)[reply]

Oppose

See: Kurkjian, Vahan M. (1958). A History of Armenia

"Recent researches and discoveries have proven that the legend of Ara, although subjected to many transformations, until the 4th and 5th centuries A.D., has its origin in Indo-European mother-sources. The Christian Armenians of the 5th century, took Ara as a man-hero, while the Armenians of the 3rd century, still pagan, had regarded him a god-like personality, or even a god.

Sammuramat is the Assyrian form of Shamiram. Erroneous statements are made by national and foreign historians, about Ara and Shamiram.

Aramis, not Barzanes, as Diodorus says, ruled Armenia at the time of the expedition of Ninus. Aramis, the king of Urartu, had formed a powerful federation of the kinglets of Armenia. He was defeated, but his successors carried on the resistance, and assured the recovery of independence for a considerably longer time.

The first mistress of Ara was an Armenian goddess: The three great ones were Nané (Sumerian-Babylonian, the Athena), Anahit, Astghik.

The ideology greatly developed in the Armenian paganism has no Avestic trait, because the ideal had no place in the Mazdeism, while in the Armenian temples of Armavir statues were erected in honor of the sun and the moon. Some scholars think to have discovered the worship of Triad (trinity) in the Armenian paganism. The edict of king Trdat, invoking Aramazd, Anahit and Vahagn, as the sources of power, and the existence in Ashtishat of the three famous temples, support this theory. The Urarteans also had three great gods — Haldis, Thiespas and Artemis. The same may be said of Zoroastrianism; Artashes cites three gods: Aramazd, Anahit and Mihr. Triad was recognized also by Semitics."

Notice the following gods/goddesses/deities/ have no equivalent in the so-called Iranian religion "Zoroastrianism": Astłik, Barshamin, Nane, Ḫaldi, Thiespas, and of course the legendary founder of the Armenian nation Hayk, and his descendants(Amasya, Ara, Aram, Aramais, Armanak, Gegham, and Harma)... --Biainili (talk) 16:09, 20 April 2020 (UTC)[reply]

Pre-GA feedback[edit]

Hi LouisAragon. I don't care too much about the tags being present or not, but I do think the close paraphrasing—especially in the Arewordikʿ section—and the over-reliance on the single source for the Controversy, assessment and issues in scholarship section should be addressed prior to a GA nom. The CLOP tag was not at all about the quoted material, and you'll see there are quite a few directly copied phrases from the source, with content in between often only lightly adjusted. I can quote some specifics to you, but I'm guessing you'll see the issue on a quick review.

Yes, one source is not automatically a problem, but the article is relying on that one source to make some serious POV claims, including disagreement with Armenian scholars, Georgian scholars, and historians of Zoroastrianism. I think all these problems are fixable without too much trouble! Firefangledfeathers (talk / contribs) 02:11, 11 March 2023 (UTC)[reply]

@Firefangledfeathers: Hey, thank you for the copy-edits first of all! Yeah, the article requires a bit more love before being nominated, no worries. By that time a few more refs and content will be added, and some existing quotes will be removed. - LouisAragon (talk) 22:11, 16 March 2023 (UTC)[reply]