Talk:Waris Ali Shah

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Language[edit]

This article needs to be cleaned up, in terms of neutral language and grammar. I've started with some, but help would be appreciated. Omirocksthisworld(Drop a line) 07:28, 31 March 2010 (UTC)[reply]

His Disciples[edit]

Baroness Warsi?[edit]

Is Baroness Warsi a noteworthy descendant of his disciples? If so, does it merit mention? She is perhaps the highest profile contemporary British Asian Muslim politician. (Is this talk section appropriate?) Bapehu (talk) 16:29, 23 November 2014 (UTC)[reply]

I think she deserves the mentionMajun e Baqi (talk) 15:34, 4 July 2020 (UTC)[reply]

@Toddy1: I would request your attention to this complex issue, lolMajun e Baqi (talk) 15:40, 4 July 2020 (UTC)[reply]

I have added Baroness to his desciple with source Majun e Baqi (talk) 06:52, 5 July 2020 (UTC)[reply]

A long time ago I met an elderly English man whose father had named him after Sir Rowland Hill. It would be fair to say that his father had admired Hill. I am not sure that it would justify saying that his father was a follower of Hill.

The source you cite is a bit like that. It says that her mother's brother was a follower of Waris Ali Shah, and changed his family name to "Warsi". This meant that mother's brother's son had the family name of "Warsi". It says that Baroness Warsi got the family name "Warsi" when she married her mother's brother's son, and that they later divorced. She also talks about a man called Bawa Jee, who presided over a shrine to Waris Ali Shah, and the book says that she admired some things about him, but did not engage in the hero worship of him that some people did.

There is nothing in the source that indicates that Baroness Warsi is, or ever was, a disciple of Waris Ali Shah. Nor does she have ancestors who were disciples of Waris Ali Shah.-- Toddy1 (talk) 07:39, 6 July 2020 (UTC)[reply]

Source: Warsi, Sayeeda (2017-03-30). The Enemy Within: A Tale of Muslim Britain. Penguin Books Limited. ISBN 978-0-241-27604-4.

Afroz Khan?[edit]

How it is possible being Afroz Khan as his desciple without any sourceMajun e Baqi (talk) 15:33, 4 July 2020 (UTC)[reply]

General discussion[edit]

Toddy1, Bapehu, Majun e Baqi, GorgeCustersSabre Just dropping my two paisa of rant...

The least & safest (& in many case the only) conclusion about the people having 'Warsi' in their name and having connect to Indian-subcontinent can be drawn is that they or someone in their family/ancestors took the Sufi-discipleship (actual or metaphorical; peer-murshid) of "Haji Waris Ali Shah" and in that process chose to add Warsi suffix to their names (we may call it last-name, sir-name, family-name, etc.).

Now, this is not binding on anyone but an observation from sort of laymen, who although no follower of Sufi-circles forget the 'Shah', have lived <15km for more than two & a half decade around Shah's mazaar and have many times frequented the actual place, have also closely observed Warsees, and then got opportunity to live at a place for over a decade which although ~2500km from Dewa has lot of (comparative) following of Waris and one can even see their yellow-clad Warsi peers-murshids in cross-faith & cross-religious gatherings.

I'll simply suggest not to remove anything in haste but definitely a bit more clarity & distinction is required between individual disciples & disciple-family connects.--Fz^tc_s 09:06, 6 July 2020 (UTC)[reply]

Wikipedia policy is that statements in articles need citations to reliable sources. If you want to claim that someone is of a particular religion, or is a follower of someone, there needs to be a citation to a reliable source. The source needs to actually mention it. Wikipedia:Verifiability-- Toddy1 (talk) 09:29, 6 July 2020 (UTC)[reply]

Bedam Shah Warsi[edit]

I am restoring the citations to Bedam Shah Warsi being his disciple from qadrishattari. xyz please. Because I do not think that addition of citations to unsourced is clearly not spam. Sometimes we need to rely on such religious orgs especially for such atypical niches where it becomes difficult to find sources. Dove's talk (talk) 18:19, 26 April 2022 (UTC)[reply]

It isn't a reliable source and the onus is on you to prove that it is. It is nothing more than a personal site created by a single individual. If there aren't adequate reliable sources, teh information cannot be included. Period. PRAXIDICAE💕 18:20, 26 April 2022 (UTC)[reply]

Addressing your concerns on relevant place. Dove's talk (talk) 18:23, 26 April 2022 (UTC)[reply]

You're not addressing them, funny enough. PRAXIDICAE💕 18:24, 26 April 2022 (UTC)[reply]